120 volt Electrician Advice

[Mitch]

The wife was having trouble getting her lap top to charge so I checked the wall socket with the multi-meter and it reads 103 volts across with another 17 volts to the ground. All the other wall sockets in the house other than the couple in that room are reading 120 volts. Lap top is not an issue, it was opperator error, but this is weird.

So what is causing the 17 volt bleed? Do I have a short and do I need to be worried about it starting a fire if I don't track it down right away? How do I go about finding it so I can fix it?

I'm guessing it's not a short or the breaker would pop, but I can't wrap my head around what would cause a drop of 1/7 voltage and don't know if it's a safety issue, please help.

 

[dpricenator]

Not sure what is causeing the voltage bleed, but sockets are cheap and easy to replace. Swap it out and see if you have the same issue.

 

[Mitch]

Not sure what is causeing the voltage bleed, but sockets are cheap and easy to replace. Swap it out and see if you have the same issue.

It's every socket on that breaker, I'm sure it's not a socket issue, it's a line issue between the breaker and the sockets. I figure it has to be lines crossing where they shouldn't or an appliance plugged in somewhere.

 

[dpricenator]

Oh I gotcha. Maybe try the breaker. Also relatively inexpensive and the just pop in and out.. But you mentioned maybe a crossed wire. Having replaced probably 200 wall sockets in my day, I know it is very easy for the wires to cross or touch if you are using a socket with the screw attachments rather than the clip attachments. you could also just pull every socket and do a look at them for abnormalities.

 

[Mitch]

Oh I gotcha. Maybe try the breaker. Also relatively inexpensive and the just pop in and out.. But you mentioned maybe a crossed wire. Having replaced probably 200 wall sockets in my day, I know it is very easy for the wires to cross or touch if you are using a socket with the screw attachments rather than the clip attachments. you could also just pull every socket and do a look at them for abnormalities.

Here is what I know, 220 volt has three wires, 110 on each hot with a common neutral but on opposite cycles so the hot to hot is 220 volts. All the 110 volts in a house is one or the other of those two hots going to neutral.

In our house I know that the neutral is hooked to the ground (was done by an electrician) in at least one spot so this may be part of the issue. It looks like I'm getting 120 volts to the socket, but for some reason 103 are running hot to neutral and 17 are running hot to ground. Here is where I'm lost as to why.

 

[Tegu]

Voltage can bleed even through insulation onto other lines that are not properly grounded, sounds like that is your issue.

 

[Mitch]

Voltage can bleed even through insulation onto other lines that are not properly grounded, sounds like that is your issue.

I found the following by doing a search, does this sound like good advice?


From the web--------------------------------------------------------
When you have low voltage at a receptacle, with normal voltages at other parts of the same circuit, there are two possibilities.

The "hot" [ungrounded] circuit conductor has a bad connection somewhere or the grounded circuit conductor [neutral] has a bad connection somewhere. If you have low voltage to neutral AND ground from the hot, the hot is bad. If the "ground" reading is normal and the "neutral" reading low, then you have a bad neutral connection.

If you have replaced the device at the "low" outlet, then the bad connection is at a previous device in the circuit. Though the hot and neutral are parallel, the device connections in either conductor are in series. Everything after the loose connection will be bad.

If you can figure out which outlet precedes the problem location, check the connections there. It is probably a loose screw, burned up splice or failed "speed-wire" connector [those little holes in the receptacle back - oh, how I hate them!]

Or just start opening up devices on that circuit. Remember that the problem can be at a location which has normal power!

TURN THE POWER OFF!

 

[Hendy]

Is there anything else on that line from the box? You might be drawing the power at another outlet on the same line.

 

[Mitch]

Is there anything else on that line from the box? You might be drawing the power at another outlet on the same line.

Not sure yet, haven't taken the time to do much checking yet, didn't have the time when I noticed it, don't think I'm gonna start a fire so will wait until the weekend to dig deeper into it.

 

[Tegu]

I found the following by doing a search, does this sound like good advice?


From the web--------------------------------------------------------
When you have low voltage at a receptacle, with normal voltages at other parts of the same circuit, there are two possibilities.

The "hot" [ungrounded] circuit conductor has a bad connection somewhere or the grounded circuit conductor [neutral] has a bad connection somewhere. If you have low voltage to neutral AND ground from the hot, the hot is bad. If the "ground" reading is normal and the "neutral" reading low, then you have a bad neutral connection.

If you have replaced the device at the "low" outlet, then the bad connection is at a previous device in the circuit. Though the hot and neutral are parallel, the device connections in either conductor are in series. Everything after the loose connection will be bad.

If you can figure out which outlet precedes the problem location, check the connections there. It is probably a loose screw, burned up splice or failed "speed-wire" connector [those little holes in the receptacle back - oh, how I hate them!]

Or just start opening up devices on that circuit. Remember that the problem can be at a location which has normal power!

TURN THE POWER OFF!

Yes, the odds are you have a bad connection somewhere, the plugs are the place to start, if you have the wiring diagram start from the first one on that circuit, if not start with the closest one.

 

[Mitch]

Not sure what is causeing the voltage bleed, but sockets are cheap and easy to replace. Swap it out and see if you have the same issue.

Seems like this was better advice than I thought, still don't think I have a bad socket, but it's likely a bad connection on one of them.

 

[Volusianator]

I'm an electrical idiot, sorry I can't help.

 

[cf2112]

Seems like this was better advice than I thought, still don't think I have a bad socket, but it's likely a bad connection on one of them.

Bingo, not a bad receptacle but a bad connection on a receptacle or switch or a loose connection (where they have wirenuts connecting multiple wires). This is probably on the neutral from your description. If you have the wires stabbed into the back of the devices instead of the wire wrapped around the screws this is most likely place to start. I recommend changing the wires from stabbed to wrapped as the loose connections cause heat and heat causes fires. We just did this exact thing recently after a switch caught fire in a customers house.

You could take out each device and look for the loose wire, my advice is call an electician. If you choose the former turn off the power and have a couple spare receptacles and switches in case you do find a bad one or break one.

If you still lived in Jeff City I do it for a cigar or two:smile: Give me a call if you want any advice.

 

[Mitch]

Bingo, not a bad receptacle but a bad connection on a receptacle or switch or a loose connection (where they have wirenuts connecting multiple wires). This is probably on the neutral from your description. If you have the wires stabbed into the back of the devices instead of the wire wrapped around the screws this is most likely place to start. I recommend changing the wires from stabbed to wrapped as the loose connections cause heat and heat causes fires. We just did this exact thing recently after a switch caught fire in a customers house.

You could take out each device and look for the loose wire, my advice is call an electician. If you choose the former turn off the power and have a couple spare receptacles and switches in case you do find a bad one or break one.

If you still lived in Jeff City I do it for a cigar or two:smile: Give me a call if you want any advice.

Thanks bro, I think I've got this covered now. Next time I'm in town we'll have to get together for another herf. My folks mentioned running into you not long ago.

 

[cf2112]

Yea saw them at breakfast on morning, my wife is still mad because I forgot to introduce her:hammersma

Lmk when you're coming and I'm sure we can arrange it.eace:

 

[Mickeyray5]

Since you are seeing 17vac from neutral to ground, you probably have a loose neutral connection somewhere between the socket and the panel. If this is the only socket doing this then try checking your voltage between that socket hot to neutral at another socket. You should see 120. As mentioned earlier in the post, a loose connection causes high resistance which leads to heat which leads to fire.

Let us know what you find.