Shilala Beads vs Heartfelt Beads

[JNT]

I dont think that changes the advantage to HF, as you just have to add water and its instantly solved. Plus there is a visual hint, when you see the beads, that they are getting dry, thus moisten them, and avoid a RH drop. Proactive. Some warning time.

It seems with these you have to be reactive, and first notice your RH is dropping, then they need to be removed, placed in a ziplock with a hygometer, and monitored till there back up to proper RH. Not sure how long it takes, but even if its only an hour to bring them back up to proper RH, thats about 59 minutes longer then the HF beads.

Looking at the cost, I dont see the advantage. Maybe I'm just perceiving it as being more tedious then it is?

 

[apaniagua]

Looking at the cost, I dont see the advantage. Maybe I'm just perceiving it as being more tedious then it is?

Many others do see it, in what sense? well, you dont have to open your humidor to recharge the beads with water. It's more maintance free than the HF beads, since you can leave them for months steady at 65% without the need of adding water. Yeah, if after a year they change their set point, so what? You didn't need to open it monthly to recharge it.

 

[wowsley]

I dont think that changes the advantage to HF, as you just have to add water and its instantly solved. Plus there is a visual hint, when you see the beads, that they are getting dry, thus moisten them, and avoid a RH drop. Proactive. Some warning time.

It seems with these you have to be reactive, and first notice your RH is dropping, then they need to be removed, placed in a ziplock with a hygometer, and monitored till there back up to proper RH. Not sure how long it takes, but even if its only an hour to bring them back up to proper RH, thats about 59 minutes longer then the HF beads.

Looking at the cost, I dont see the advantage. Maybe I'm just perceiving it as being more tedious then it is?

X2

Exactly what I was thinking. But .... to each his own. As long as are sticks are smoking, that's all that matters.

 

[Jwrussell]

I think you are trying to make this a 'better than' conversation when it doesn't need to be. Both HF and HCM have their own unique benefits. HCM supposedly holds much more moisture and reacts faster. Further, you can change the set point if you wish. HF has a visual clue and allows you to add water directly. One may work better for one application and vice versa.

 

[JNT]

I think you are trying to make this a 'better than' conversation when it doesn't need to be.

Don't disagree, but this is labeled a 'vs' thread. Thought that was the point.

 

[JNT]

Many others do see it, in what sense? well, you dont have to open your humidor to recharge the beads with water. It's more maintance free than the HF beads, since you can leave them for months steady at 65% without the need of adding water. Yeah, if after a year they change their set point, so what? You didn't need to open it monthly to recharge it.

But you have to remove them from your humidor, and throw them in a ziplock for however long to get them back up to humidity. The HF beads dont have to be removed, and are recharged in a matter of seconds. Which is more ideal? Obviously leaving your beads in the humidor, and never having to remove them.

How quickly either looses their humidity in the same environment, I would like to know. Do you have knowledge that the same amount of Shilala beads will hold their RH longer then the HF beads? Then we can discuss that benefit/deficiency in one over the other. If that is equal, then I don't see the advantage in Shilala beads.

 

[Jwrussell]

Don't disagree, but this is labeled a 'vs' thread. Thought that was the point.

Aye, but the poll is 'what do you use', not 'which is better' isn't it? Figured that was what was meant by 'vs'. Either way, like I said, depends on the individual situation and application. Both have their positives and negatives.

 

[Jwrussell]

Wow, JNT. Got a dog in this fight somehow? :wink:

But you have to remove them from your humidor, and throw them in a ziplock for however long to get them back up to humidity. The HF beads dont have to be removed, and are recharged in a matter of seconds. Which is more ideal? Obviously leaving your beads in the humidor, and never having to remove them.

Maybe it is because I use my HF beads in a cooler'dor and wine'idor and haven't had a true humidor in a few years, but I don't recharge my beads inside my humidors. I suppose it depends on how you keep your beads but most of mine are in mesh bags, so the come out, get water added and then sit for a bit to make sure there is no leakage. Not that big of a difference.

How quickly either looses their humidity in the same environment, I would like to know. Do you have knowledge that the same amount of Shilala beads will hold their RH longer then the HF beads? Then we can discuss that benefit/deficiency in one over the other. If that is equal, then I don't see the advantage in Shilala beads.

I plan on doing some tests on this once I have my HCM/Shilala beads and I'll be sure to post what I see here.

 

[JNT]

Im not trying to knock them in any way, start any kind of fight, or create tension. Its just cigar humidification were talking about. I'm just seriously interested in buying some, and have questions before I throw down my money. Wanted the clarifications about how they work, perform and upkeep (which I still have not heard firm answers on).

I don't think the fact that a large group buy is going on should hinder or stop friendly discussion/concerns about the performance of the product out of fear of hurting the sellers feelings. If its a good product, then it should stand in the face of scrutiny compared to its counterparts, which this thread has become a venue for.

 

[Jwrussell]

I'm just seriously interested in buying some, and have questions before I throw down my money. Wanted the clarifications about how they work, perform and upkeep (which I still have not heard firm answers on).

No question at all, you should ask as many questions as necessary to feel comfortable before putting money down, and I wasn't trying to suggest you not do so. But at the same time, I have to question your last statement. What questions do you feel are not being answered? The only question I've really seen you ask is how to recharge the beads, and that's been answered pretty thoroughly. You seem to want to focus on the fact that you see HF being superior to HCM beads in how you recharge them. That's one of the benefits to HF beads. You have a visual clue on when to recharge and doing so is quick and easy. You say you don't need to remove them from your humidor. I say that all depends on how you are storing your beads, as adding water directly to them can lead to open water inside your humidor if you aren't careful and do not have something to catch the leakage. I would guess many, if not most, remove their HF beads to recharge. Is it still faster and more of a 'no-brainer'? Sure.
Now, aren't we kind of beating a dead horse (we don't have an emoticon for that!?) on that particular issue at this point?

I don't think the fact that a large group buy is going on should hinder or stop friendly discussion/concerns about the performance of the product out of fear of hurting the sellers feelings.

And where do you see the above happening here? In what way? I have no relationship with HCM. In fact, I've been using HF for years. I've supported the product, recommended it to others, and I've asked some pretty pointed questions in another thread as to the workings of HCM. So I have no dog in this fight other than being interested in both products. Yes, I'm in on the group buy because I want to try the HCM product out to see how it works and compares to HF. But for you to insinuate that I, or anyone else on this thread for that matter is trying to "hinder or stop friendly discussion" is downright insulting.

If its a good product, then it should stand in the face of scrutiny compared to its counterparts, which this thread has become a venue for.

Very true, and it's not like we haven't had discussions in the past on this. In fact, here's a recent thread on basically the same thing:

4 pages HCM vs HF

 

[JNT]

The main questions I have not got a definitive on is, how long is my humidor going to be without the beads till their recharged?

I notice one day I'm now sitting at 60, and it not just a temporary drop due to my door being open or something, and decide to throw them in a ziplock for a recharge. How long, on average, to get back up to 65, 70. Is this something I have to sit there and watch, or done over night? Minutes, hours, days?

Then there is the whole question of how long they hold their RH, compared to the HF?

Two big questions in IMO.

 

[TravelingJ]

How quickly either looses their humidity in the same environment, I would like to know. Do you have knowledge that the same amount of Shilala beads will hold their RH longer then the HF beads? Then we can discuss that benefit/deficiency in one over the other. If that is equal, then I don't see the advantage in Shilala beads.

A local friend of mine, has 2 similar cabinets, right next to each other in his basement. One of them has Heartfelt beads, the other has HCM beads. His Heartfelts need water every 2 weeks, while the HCM hasn't been recharged in 3 months so far.

 

[CigarNut]

The main questions I have not got a definitive on is, how long is my humidor going to be without the beads till their recharged?

I notice one day I'm now sitting at 60, and it not just a temporary drop due to my door being open or something, and decide to throw them in a ziplock for a recharge. How long, on average, to get back up to 65, 70. Is this something I have to sit there and watch, or done over night? Minutes, hours, days?

Then there is the whole question of how long they hold their RH, compared to the HF?

Two big questions in IMO.

I thought answered this. But I will try again.

I cannot give you a definitive answer on this as it depends upon many things, but the two most important are: how much beads you are trying to recharge and how much you need to change the RH.

In most cases, one 8 ounce bag can be raised one or two percent in less than an hour. Worst case could be 8 hours or more to raise the RH of several 8 ounce bags of beads to whatever you need and to verify that the beads are indeed at the correct RH.

It's not like it will take weeks to raise or lower the RH. It will not hurt your cigars or your humidor to be without your beads for a short period of time -- even a few days.

When I recharge my beads I put them in the ziplock with a damp sponge. After 30 minutes I remove the sponge and leave them for another 30 minutes to see what the surface RH of the beads is now at. I repeat this process until the surface RH is 1 or 2 points higher than I want them to be. Then I let them sit in the ziplock for four hours without a sponge to make sure that the RH change has had time to "soak through" the entire bag.

I keep my three humidors at different RH's. NC's at 68%, CC's at 63%, and a small one with a CC custom roll at 60%. I recharge my beads when they drop 2%. I usually have to recharge my beads after about 3 or 4 months.

The climate here in the Portland, Oregon metro area this time of year is high's of mid 60's to low 70's with an RH around 45%. Our home does not get below 65 degrees (furnace kicks in). The humidity and temps increase during the summer, but we run A/C in the summer so our house remains dryer.

Reducing the RH is more dependant upon the ambient RH of your home. If it is lower than where you want the beads to be you can just leave the beads out, testing them every 30-60 minutes. If your ambient RH is high then you need to use the refrigerator to lower the RH -- there are detailed instructions on doing this included with the beads and also on my website. Again, this process is well defined while it might take longer than it does to raise the RH, it is still a manageable amount of time.

[please note that this process is different from how I initially charge the beads and set them at 65%. I do that slowly over a period of 5-8 days.]

I hope this helps...

 

[JNT]

Thank you.