Short barrel (3") defensive carry ammo
- Thread starter Zmilin
- Start date
any quality bonded JHP that feeds reliably in your pistol will do the trick..
with 9mm, especially in short barrels, I have always preferred heavier bullets, and typically go with 147gr.. but thats not necessarily the "right" answer for you..
Currently my G19 is loaded with 147gr Remington Golden Sabers.. (Same load I've been carrying in my 9mm's for more more than 15 years at this point..)..
Normally I would recommend checking out the golden sabers as well as similar offerings from speer, winchester, federal, etc..etc.. and tell you to just test some out, find out what works well in your pistol.. and go with it..
All that said.. the CEO of Liberty Ammunition is a friend of mine.. Liberty goes the complete opposite route with their ammo.. they believe in super lightweight, monolithic, fragmenting hollow points..
The test results I have seen are pretty impressive/interesting.. I'll be getting my hands on a couple of boxes soon and plan on putting them through the paces to see what I think first hand.. Will also be putting some of their hunting ammo to the test to see how it works against flesh/bone as opposed to just how well it performs on paper... Will let you know what I think after I've been able to check it out for a while..
http://libertyammunition.com/product/civil-defense-9mm
with 9mm, especially in short barrels, I have always preferred heavier bullets, and typically go with 147gr.. but thats not necessarily the "right" answer for you..
Currently my G19 is loaded with 147gr Remington Golden Sabers.. (Same load I've been carrying in my 9mm's for more more than 15 years at this point..)..
Normally I would recommend checking out the golden sabers as well as similar offerings from speer, winchester, federal, etc..etc.. and tell you to just test some out, find out what works well in your pistol.. and go with it..
All that said.. the CEO of Liberty Ammunition is a friend of mine.. Liberty goes the complete opposite route with their ammo.. they believe in super lightweight, monolithic, fragmenting hollow points..
The test results I have seen are pretty impressive/interesting.. I'll be getting my hands on a couple of boxes soon and plan on putting them through the paces to see what I think first hand.. Will also be putting some of their hunting ammo to the test to see how it works against flesh/bone as opposed to just how well it performs on paper... Will let you know what I think after I've been able to check it out for a while..
http://libertyammunition.com/product/civil-defense-9mm
That's interesting. It goes against the norm that Ive been reading about.
ChuckMejia
The General
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I dont think there is a "norm" personally.. people that get hitched too hard to one round or another when it comes to pistol cartridges are frankly fooling themselves or buying into gun store commando BS (IMO)...
There are certainly brands/types of ammo that work.. and there are brands/types that dont.. but those are generally pretty easy to separate.. if you buy american made, from a well known/well established manufacturer, and buy their "personal defense" loading.. you are likely getting something that will go "bang" every time you pull the trigger (assuming you have a quality pistol to start with).. and likely have something that will perform well on its intended target..
The first critical step (again, my opinion) in selecting a personal defense load is figuring out whether or not it will cycle/function reliably in your pistol..
Certain pistols are notorious for not liking "long" cartridges, or not liking "+p".. or not liking "low recoil".. some pistols feed ramps are too steep or too narrow to reliably feed wide mouthed, deep cavity hollow points like the speer gold dot, etc..
These are generally design flaws with the particular pistol.. but they can be easily overcome by figuring out what ammo the pistol does like to eat.. and then going with that..
The easiest "test" I know for this is to simply buy a box of whatever you are interested in, go to the range, and get some practice... if it reliably feeds (meaning ZERO malfunctions).. buy another box and do it again.. if it reliably feeds again.. repeat the process.. once you have fired 100 rounds through the pistol with ZERO malfunctions.. its a pretty safe bet that your chosen round is a good match for your chosen pistol..
At the end of the day ALL normal "combat" calibers for pistols are piss poor man stoppers.. we can get into the 9mm vs 45 debate or the "how small is too small? .380 vs .32?" or "heavy vs. light projectile" discussions all day long.. but what never changes is that hollywood has fed us a line of BS when it comes to the actual effectiveness of pistols in a fight..
Depending on which study/report you want to believe, the mortality rate for people shot by handguns in the US is somewhere between 14-18%.. and the mortality rate for people shot by guns in general (including rifles and shotguns is between 25-27%.. (rifles and shotguns are MUCH, MUCH more effective.. but they are also much less frequently used.. so they only bring the total mortality rate up to about double.. when they themselves (depending on what caliber you are talking) usually 3x more effective man stoppers than pistols)..
In other words.. only about 1 out of every 6 people shot with a pistol actually die as a result of being shot..
The difference in fatalities between people shot with heavy loads vs light loads.. or 9mm vs .45 vs .38 vs .40 is minimal..
So.. while a 230gr speer gold dot (.45) may perform X% better in ballistic gelatin than a 147gr federal hydroshock (9mm).. the reality is that on the street, the results are almost identical...
Shot placement and the ability to put multiple shots in the vitals is what makes the difference.. (people shot more than once, by any caliber or loading, tend to die more frequently than people shot only once, by any caliber or loading)..
All of that said.. I will take any advantage I can (no matter how minor or small).. and want to select the absolute best round for a personal protection pistol that is available..
The #1 most important thing in selecting a personal defense load is reliability (IMO).. if the round wont cycle in the gun 100% of the time when conditions are perfect (standing still, making sure I have a proper stance, grip, etc.. clean, lubed pistol, etc..etc..).. then how can I expect the weapon to cycle properly when conditions suck (like in a fight). where Im bouncing all around, the target is bouncing all around, my grip is weak, my stance is poor, the pistol has been rolled in the dirt, etc..)..
the #2 thing is performance on target..
Performance has a whole lot of factors though..
How quickly and accurately can you get off multiple shots? lighter bullets tend to produce less recoil and faster follow up shots than heavier bullets.. "standard" velocity rounds tend to produce less recoil and faster follow up shots than +p round, etc... but.. on the other side of that equation.. heavier bullets tend to penetrate better and expand better, as do +p rounds...
And you go with what makes best sense, or provides the best balance to respond to the threats that you think you might have (that is also proven reliable in your pistol)..
At the end of the day, no matter what you choose, a pistol is a piss poor man/threat stopper as a general rule.. youre going to have to put multiple rounds on vitals to be able to reliably stop a threat..
What I find interesting/promising about the liberty ammo that Im going to test is they claim (and seem to have some decent reviews online by some people that would have a clue about what is important in a "combat" load) to bring the best of both worlds in one cartridge...
they are selling a round with a super lightweight projectile, very low recoil, etc.. that is supposed to be extremely reliable in most common pistol platforms.. that still has enough penetration to consistently reach vitals in human targets.. that also intentionally fragments upon entering the target (preventing over penetration.. something pretty important in close quarters or when innocents are in the immediate area), and delivers all of its energy inside the target..
Several companies have made similar claims in the past.. but have failed to actually produce the claimed results when it came right down to it...
I am hopeful that liberty has "cracked the code" and that they really are delivering what they claim (will be taking their rifle ammo on a hunt in February, and hopefully will find out.. and will be shooting some of their pistol stuff in January to see how it functions in a couple of different 9mm's)...
I'm interested in your results/findings with the Liberty ammo.
before I started carrying remington golden sabers (what I was issued as a LEO).. I carried federal hydro-shoks for probably a decade (before we were issued department weapons and ammo).. was always reliable and performed well in every platform I ever ran them through, regardless of caliber, make, or model.. I wouldnt hesitate to start carrying federal again..Speaking as a former LEO -- I highly recommend anything from Federal. Always stone cold reliable. Just make sure whatever you're shooting feeds reliably!
Federal also makes some of my favorite hunting ammo.. their vital shok line with the trophy bonded bear claw bullets are accurate in every rifle I have ever put them through.. and hold up exceptionally well to high velocity impacts (7mm mag) and penetrate like crazy..
Federal gold medal match was the only factory ammo I would shoot in my precision rifle when I was a sniper with my departments SWAT team.. The only other factory ammo I could find that was even close to as accurate was lake city..
Federal makes great stuff..
as a retired LEO, I did ballistic testing on many of the rounds out there. Personally I carry the Hornady Critical Defense rounds in all my guns. Best bang for the buck wth great penetration and expansion. Hydrashok rounds are good also. Be careful with +P ammo in the Shield. It is not recommended by the manufacturer.