Legalities-Cigar Pass & Trades?

[Prometheus]

So I heard from my father that a guy we know was arrested and charged with felonies for selling cigars. Poor guy lost his license to practice his profession. I was wondering if you KNOW the legalities in respects to 3 things. 1. The passes? Are they ok since no money is changing hands? 2. Trades, again same concept. Trading stick for stick. 3. Is it ok to send these passes and trades via USPS, or that some kind of federal law being violated?

Is there a site I can pull up to read the laws on this. I work for a bank and am pretty sure a felony would end a career that I absolutely LOVE. So input would be great. Thanks guys.

 

[Wasch_24]

Good questions...I'll see what I can find.

 

[caudio51]

Hmmmm not sure....

 

[Wasch_24]

I found this.

In thinking about it for a few I don't see how there can be anything illegal with it as far as the USPS is concerned...online vendors (stateside and overseas) use the USP and declare the packages as tobacco related when required to.

 

[Jwrussell]

Promethius...any other details? Felony for selling cigars??? I can see if they were Cubans, then it's a seperate matter, but otherwise I'm a bit confused...

 

[SeanGAR]

I can see if they were Cubans, then it's a seperate matter, but otherwise I'm a bit confused...

Could be selling to minors.

 

[Prometheus]

Sorry, no on the details. I can (and will be doing) do more research into his particulars. But from what I understood, or the impression I was left with, he was doing something simular to what we do. Selling onesy twosy, etc.

 

[thebigo]

Technically mowing your neighbors lawn and not declaring it is illegal. They don't care...you're not moving 5 lbs of rocks or anything.

 

[MichiganM]

I don't get it. He was charged with what? I don't understand what the crime was...was he profiting from selling cigars and he's evading income tax? I can't imagine Federal officials setting up a sting for selling a couple cigars online. And cigar passes aren't for profit anyway. I didn't know you had to claim sales, if you're doing a box split etc. That sounds crazy to me.

 

[indyrob]

He was probably doing it as a business w/o paying taxes and then got hit with the obligatory sale to a minor.

Like most things, being a private citizen gives you a little bit of comfort that businesses don't

Brewing beer
Distiling spirits
Box splits
Box Passes
The occasional sale to friends

As long as you don't MAKE money off of these (Recover your expense and that's it.) you can do it without getting arrested.

Using USPS to distribute any type of contraband is highly illegal, and I think that goes w/o saying, but the exchanges that we do here aren't that big of a deal...really not that big.

I'm not a lawyer, but I did sleep at a holiday-inn last night...

 

[MichiganM]

I'm not a lawyer, but I did sleep at a holiday-inn last night...

:rofl:

 

[Prometheus]

As long as you don't MAKE money off of these (Recover your expense and that's it.) you can do it without getting arrested.

Using USPS to distribute any type of contraband is highly illegal, and I think that goes w/o saying, but the exchanges that we do here aren't that big of a deal...really not that big.

OK, so that is what I was thinking, I too am not a lawyer so I had to ask. I mean we all know trades, passes, the sales happen, and for the most part no trouble comes of it. But then again alot of people would visit a "Speak Easy" and bought bathtub gin in the 20's and 30's. Didn't mean they weren't breaking the law.

Just so I understand, technically we shouldn't be mailing these?

 

[MichiganM]

OK, so that is what I was thinking, I too am not a lawyer so I had to ask. I mean we all know trades, passes, the sales happen, and for the most part no trouble comes of it. But then again alot of people would visit a "Speak Easy" and bought bathtub gin in the 20's and 30's. Didn't mean they weren't breaking the law.

Just so I understand, technically we shouldn't be mailing these?

Domestic cigars aren't contraband. Speak Easy's were selling illegal products. Now, cuban cigars may be a different story. But it is legal to OWN cuban cigars in the USA. You can even bring them back from Cuba if they're under a certain amount. I really don't see the problem here. You're selling boxes of cubans every month?? That would be different. I think this guy got busted for selling cigars and not posting revenue. That's how it sounds to me.

 

[cvm4]

I don't believe you are allowed to bring back cuban cigars from a sanctioned trip to Cuba. It is illegal for you to possess cuban cigars and for you to even smoke them outside the country. Contrary to what some might believe, the embargo was tightened even more a couple years ago. I opt for the "don't ask, don't tell" policy :wink:

 

[MichiganM]

"Only persons returning directly from Cuba after a licensed visit there are permitted to bring Cuban cigars into the United States, provided the domestic value of such cigars does not exceed 100 U.S. dollars and the cigars are for that person's personal use and not for resale. Inasmuch as all other importations of Cuban cigars are illegal, you must assume that all offers to buy or sell such cigars in the United States involve cigars that are imported illegally. Contrary to what many people believe, it is illegal for travelers to bring into the United States Cuban cigars acquired in third countries (such as Canada, England, or Mexico)."

"It is illegal for U.S. persons to buy, sell, trade, give away, or otherwise engage in (or offer to engage in) transactions involving illegally-imported Cuban cigars. The penalties for doing so include, in addition to confiscation of the cigars, civil fines of up to $50,000 per violation and, in appropriate cases, criminal prosecution which may result in imprisonment."

The above was the last info I've seen online relating to this matter. After searching U.S. Customs website that seems to have changed??? I never knew that. As far as I knew you could still bring in 100 dollars worth of cigars. I guess I'm mistaken.

 

[indyrob]

I'm pretty sure that absolutely no US dollars are to be spent on anything from Cuba, even if it's purchased from a second, third, or even fourth party.Owning them is having the burden of proof on you that they were a gift, and not purchased. So in that respect, all things Cuban are illegal unless they fall under the Free Havana or Pre-embargo clause.

 

[indyrob]

I wouldn't ping the customs site too much...

 

[MichiganM]

Does anyone know when this changed? Back when I was heavy into cigars that 100 dollar rule was gospel. Has it changed under Bush? I'm sorry for the threadjack.

 

[tripp]

So where is our Consigliere, scottsins?

This is why we pay you the big bucks and the great parking spot.:rofl: :rofl:

 

[MichiganM]

Just so I understand, technically we shouldn't be mailing these?

To get off the threadjack and answer your question. As far as I know as long as it's domestic cigars and you're not profiting, then you can mail them.